It’s almost official. After soaring in yesterday’s hearing, there is a party for HRC tonight. Tomorrow the vote. Then it will be time for her to resign her Senate seat, right about the time New Yorkers seem to have cooled on Kennedy.
New York State voters have cooled on Caroline Kennedy and more voters now prefer State Attorney General Andrew Cuomo 31 – 24 percent for Hillary Clinton’s U.S. Senate seat, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released today. U.S. Rep. Carolyn Maloney gets 6 percent, with 5 percent for U.S. Rep. Kirsten Gillibrand, 2 percent for U.S. Rep. Steve Israel, 18 percent for someone else and 14 percent undecided.
Still, voters say 38 – 33 percent that Gov. David Paterson will appoint Ms. Kennedy to the U.S. Senate.
This is a bit personal for both sides, even without the marriage split between Cuomo and Kennedy’s cousin Kerry. The dish on that divorce filled New York columns.
It won’t be long now.
Sorry about my mistake on Will and Noonan. Gret thing about this site,someone always corrects misinformation.
From thread below…agreed that Joe is a bore lately…seems angry. His stance on torture is unacceptable and he thinks everyone else is soft.Christa Freeland makes him crazy…got to admire her..she hang in there. I always wish Joe had the courage to have that conversation wit a manley man like Joe Wilson.
Poor Caroline,she does not appear to be cut out for politics. Seems like all the stories I have read through the years report that Jackie raised her kids to be anything but regular Kennedys. She seems alot like her mother,reserved,smart,thoughtful.No particular drive.
I love Caroline but it looks lie she’ll have to start down the ladder a bit if she really wants to get into politics. It might be better for her in the long run to learn the ropes.
It’s remarkable that she came out so unprepared, fumbling and thinking it would be easy. Once she had that “you know” interview, I think people took a new look, because they were shocked at how awful she was in it.
It’s interesting that NYorkers polled still think she’ll get picked.
Man opens fire on school bus
January 14, 2009 11:43 AM | 1 Comment
A man shot at a school bus on the Near Southwest Side this morning and paramedics were checking on at least two passengers to see if they were injured, officials said.
The gunman fired at the bus near Cermak Road and Wolcott Avenue about 11:15 a.m., authorities said.
“There are a couple kids we’re looking at for minor injuries possibly from shattering glass,” Chicago Fire Department spokesman Larry Langford said.
News item, djjl. Please feel free to post it “In the News.”
Sorry, Taylor, I forgot.
Since I’m not a New Yorker I’m staying out of this “hot potato.”
Hey, no problemo, djjl. I just thought everyone might want to read it and people check those headlines often.
OH NO, Betsy. We want to hear *everyone’s* thoughts!
I would love to see Caroline as an ambassador. She has the quiet dignity and reserve for that and has the advantage of being Jackie’s daughter. Her mother was very much admired for her grace and dignity and that would serve Caroline well as I think she has her mother’s personality and temperment. I just don’t see her as the Senator from NY. And I am not putting her down because she is an extremely intelligent woman. I just don’t see her cut out to be a Senator.
With that said, I’m not particularly fond of Andrew Cuomo either. I think he’s got baggage and belongs to the “political machinery.”
What kills me is that I’ve heard talk about not continuing dynasties, yet with both Cuomo and Kennedy that’s exactly what we’d be doing. Why can’t we get some new blood into the Senate?
Jane Austen | 01.14.2009 – 1:37 pm | #
I agree with you Jane. And I really get the feeling that Ted talked her into this. I’m not too sure that this is her idea alone. In fact I’d bet that it wasn’t her idea. I think Ted wants more Kennedys at the WH. Just MO.
Here’s Simon’s 2 cents.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/13/politics/politico/main4719974.shtml?tag=topStories;secondStory
“(The Politico) This story was written by Roger SimonHow come Roland Burris has had such an easy time getting to the U.S. Senate while Caroline Kennedy has had such a hard time?
Could it be that the race card trumps the gender card in U.S. politics?
Well, yes. It could be.
Once supporters of Roland Burris made his appointment to the Senate all about race, the deal was done, though it took a few days for Senate leaders to wake up to the fact. “
Gender – the socially acceptable discrimination and bigotry.
I think some more is worth reading:
“A better comparison for Palin to make would have been the patty-cake treatment Roland Burris has gotten from the press.
Where does Roland Burris stand on the fighting in Gaza?
Where does he stand on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan?
How does he feel about Obama’s financial bailout plan?
In fact, where does Burris stand on any major issue?
Who knows? Let’s just seat the guy and get it over with!
Caroline Kennedy got asked serious questions about serious issues, and some thought her answers were vague and inarticulate. Fair enough.
But how come she got asked them and Roland Burris did not?
In the end, Caroline Kennedy may get appointed to the Senate. But if she is, it won’t be because her supporters played the gender card.
And that’s because there is no such card to play.”
By Roger Simon
Interesting article by Simon. I read it earlier. I do agree about the race card being played by Bobby Rush.
And I do agree that burris is really getting off easier than Caroline. Also, I’m not so sure that experience is a great thing. Anyone bright enough can learn quickly. I’ve said that for years. It’s nice to see fresh new people in the Congress that haven’t been deep into politics. Having said that, I do believe that a novice has to be questioned thoroughly to make sure they know what the issues are and can talk about them.
Geez, I’m just rambling. I’ll shut up.
Kennedy frankly reduces the senator position to nothing more than a give-away in politics.
That may have been OK in the past.
Given our current situation, where we really need people who can not only read briefs but also read people?
She’s not prepared.
Considering that by the very nature that this Senate seat is currently available ONLY through an appointment, it is a political give away. Just like Burris. And all the other appointees.
Roger Simon is positing a false analogy. Burris’ appointment was completely legitimate and within the law. No one disputed that. Just as no one disputed that Burris was objectively qualified to hold the seat, by dint of political experience and educational background.
In contrast, Caroline Kennedy has never held elective office. And, as evidenced by this very blog, many people (not just NYers, and not just women) believe she lacks the heft to succeed Hillary Clinton. The differing treatment has nothing to do with race/gender, and everything to do with perceived competence.
I believe with all my heart that a woman should be appointed to Hillary’s seat. I also believe Caroline is qualified for the appointment.
The irony is that the most vociferous opposition to Caroline is coming from women. White women, to be specific. So how can this possibly be a case of gender (or reverse racial) discrimination? It’s ridiculous. The differing treatment has nothing to do with race/gender, and everything to do with perceived competence. Roger Simon’s dog will not hunt.
Simon’s dog hunts quite well.
It seems that some cannot tolerate the discussion of gender inequality. Only racial inequality is considered to be of any import. Just ask ogenec and folks like Donna B.
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 3:05 pm | #
Djjl, this is beyond silly. What do I have to do to convince you that I am all for gender equality?? In the bizarre world in which you live, I support a woman to replace Hillary, and support Caroline to be that woman. Many women here (AnninCa and Jane Austen, to name a few), don’t support Caroline. Jane is not even willing to go as far as I am — she believes that the best person should be appointed to replace Hillary, regardless of gender.
So how is it that I have become your poster boy for gender inequality? Believe what you want. You know nothing of me, and yet you are willing to ascribe to me all kinds of beliefs. The mind boggles….
I don’t just like to win arguments, I like to annihilate my opponents. Here’s a link to the polling results for Kennedy/Cuomo: http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_NY_105.pdf
Look at the cross-tabs on page 3. 57% of women prefer Cuomo. Only 28% of women prefer Kennedy.
Now, I’m no math major. But I think that means that WOMEN back Cuomo over Kennedy by a ratio of nearly 2 to 1. Some gender inequality, that.
Djjl, I’m through being polite with you. STFU.
Oops, that should be a ratio of OVER 2 to 1. Like I said, I didn’t major in math.
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 3:05 pm | #
just FYI but the PUMA crowd HATES Caroline, somehow they equate her in the Senate as an insult to Hillary (it’s some very strange logic) They hate Caroline because they hate anyone who didn’t back Hillary… ANYONE, male of female.
ogenec | 01.14.2009 – 3:33 pm |
Just to reiterate ogenec – I do not support Andrew Cuomo. My person of choice happens to be Carolyn Maloney who happens to not only be qualified with political experience but is also a woman. The fact that she is a woman is secondary to the fact that she is extremely qualified. I have watched her political career since she has been in Congress and the lady impressed me. New York has many problems; one of the biggest is melding upstate problems with NYC problems. You have to have a feel for the people and a willingness to wade into the deep water, something I don’t feel Ms. Kennedy is able to do at this time. Many upstate New Yorkers don’t see Ms. Kennedy as someone they can support and more than likely if Pete King runs and she is his opponent they will opt for him. I won’t because I refuse to vote for a Republican and he isn’t exactly my favorite person.
GeoT | 01.14.2009 – 3:42 pm | #
The PUMAs have their own problems. I don’t understand their rationale and I don’t have the time or the patience to try and figure out the motives. I find them ludicrous.
So how is it that I have become your poster boy for gender inequality? Believe what you
want. You know nothing of me, and yet you are willing to ascribe to me all kinds of beliefs.
The mind boggles….
ogenec | 01.14.2009 – 3:17 pm | #
ogenec
You ar NO poster boy for me or anyone else that I know of.
A Sampling of posters here ( or anywhere else) and who they support has absolutely nothing to do with Roger Simon’s article. The fact that you support a female to replace HRC is irrelevant.
As to whether or not you choose to be polite is something about which you alone can control. I do not intend to shut up.
To paraphrase an oft repeated refrain from StephBoston – Try some critical reading before you respond to something I did not say.
“It seems that some cannot tolerate the discussion of gender inequality. Only racial inequality is considered to be of any import. Just ask ogenec and folks like Donna B.”
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 3:05 pm |
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 3:05 pm | #
just FYI but the PUMA crowd HATES Caroline, somehow they equate her in the Senate as an
insult to Hillary (it’s some very strange logic) They hate Caroline because they hate anyone
who didn’t back Hillary… ANYONE, male of female.
GeoT | 01.14.2009 – 3:42 pm | #
GeoT
I really don’t care anything about who doesn’t support Caroline. Roger Simon’s article was not addressing anything other than the lack of equivalency in the questioning and coverage variances. Ogenec’s response had nothing really to do with the substance of the article.
Motes in eyes and all
Just to reiterate ogenec – I do not support Andrew Cuomo. My person of choice happens to be
Carolyn Maloney who happens to not only be qualified with political experience but is also a woman. The fact that she is a woman is secondary to the fact that she is extremely qualified.
Jane Austen | 01.14.2009 – 3:44 pm | #
Jane, I did mean to imply that you support Cuomo. Your support for Maloney is well-known. I was just noting that you the believe the best person, regardless of gender, should be appointed. For you, that person is Maloney. Hope I did not take your name in vain
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 4:26 pm | #
Shut up or don’t, I really don’t care. But you should have learned by now not to tangle with me. The last time we tussled, I schooled you on the issue of homosexuals as a protected class. Remember that?
Now you’re back for more, bleating like a fucking goat about my alleged disinterest in gender inequality. I am interested, where it exists. It doesn’t exist here, as I’ve proved. Conclusively. If Caroline is not appointed, it will be because women (again, white women) prevailed upon Patterson not to. End of story.
And I know you’re crazy and all, but you’re not too far gone to recognize the irony of YOU telling ME to try some critical reading, are you? Are you?
You know, I enjoy these debates better when my opponent has a modicum of intelligence.
Ogenec’s response had nothing really to do with the substance of the article.
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 4:31 pm | #
Motes in eyes and all
djjl | 01.14.2009 – 4:31 pm | #
you lost me, I wasn’t referencing ogenic in any way.
I just find it curious that a group that cries sexism is so violently anti any woman who’s only fault is that she backed Obama. Maybe that’s just crazyism.
I have to admit at first I thought Caroline Kennedy had a lot of nerve thinking she could just call up the Governor and have a US Senate seat handed to her because of her name and fortune. It probably didn’t help that she didn’t endorse her own senator from New York who happenned to be the first woman in this country with a chance of winning the Presidency. But then I thought about it – I’m going to vote Democratic anyway, so as long as the Governor gives each contender a fair and thoughtful hearing, it’s his decision to make and I think he is a pretty good guy. Whatever he decides is okay with me. I don’t think Caroline is particularly well prepared or articulate about the position, but that may be her handlers’ fault. Creating the air of “inevitibility”, having her cousin Kerry swooning over her on national TV, ignoring reporters’ questions on her 15 minute tour of Upstate, and the “you know” interview probably affected her poll numbers. Maybe that’s her first stumble in public and she will regroup and adjust. Perhaps she will make a better case behind closed doors to the Governor. Her name and fundraising ability carry weight. I decided I am going to free myself and not be petty about it. I would prefer Hillary’s replacement be a woman, though. We need more diversity in the US Senate. But whatever Governor Paterson decides is fine by me. This can’t be easy for him.
Wow, this got heated!
I am not opposed to Kennedy. My issue is the pay-to-play aspect of this appointment. It’s really not a great time to be rewarding her support in the primaries with a senator’s job. I mean…..that’s a fairly hefty payoff!
More important, it degrades the position and opens up the question of why we expect the Senate to truly understand the complexities that face our country when we don’t really insist on experience, even, to be a senator.
It got heated because I was accused without any proof or justification of being something I am not. Now that I have disposed of the village idiot, I am back to being my sunny self.
Lynette, did not address your post last night @ 8:04 pm. It’s very thoughtful and even-handed. Thanks.
Lynette, did not address your post last night @ 8:04 pm. It’s very thoughtful and
even-handed. Thanks.
ogenec | 01.15.2009 – 12:47 pm
Thank you so much, Ogenec. I am not a “yes” person (that would be boring) nor am I in perfect sync with everybody here, but I am honest – and fair to others’ opinions, even if they’re different from mine.
I hope the Gov selects a woman to fill the vacancy. We simply can’t afford to lose a woman in the Senate, since we are only about 16% of Congress now.
BAC